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	<title>Comments on: George Phillies: &#8216;New LNC Budget is Slow Death for Our Party&#8217;</title>
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	<description>Covering America's third parties and independent candidates since May 2008</description>
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		<title>By: Robert Capozzi</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139326</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Capozzi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Dec 2009 10:27:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139326</guid>
		<description>I was kinda kidding.  Splitting front/back office ain&#039;t a bad idea, although both would then be tiny.  And you lose office synergies/management.

Again, I&#039;d suggest office savings makes sense when the lease is up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was kinda kidding.  Splitting front/back office ain&#8217;t a bad idea, although both would then be tiny.  And you lose office synergies/management.</p>
<p>Again, I&#8217;d suggest office savings makes sense when the lease is up.</p>
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		<title>By: George Phillies</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139254</link>
		<dc:creator>George Phillies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Dec 2009 04:28:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139254</guid>
		<description>Moving to a slum is not clever.  There are available interns in any reasonable area with a few universities or several other options, e.g., areas with underemployed Libertarian volunteers.

Putting a media office with publicist and front end secretary in DC has nothing to to with putting the back office operations in DC.

As to staff, for what we pay putting the office someplace where staff can afford to live might be an advantage as well as a disadvantage.

In my opinion, Uzbeckistan would not be so sensible a place for our party HQ, but one can find a list of other good choices fairly painlessly.  I&#039;m not saying that moving is the right thing to do, but in considering it you would be better off having the alternatives a bit more clear in your thoughts.

Recall that this coming year that office will cost perhaps $140,000.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Moving to a slum is not clever.  There are available interns in any reasonable area with a few universities or several other options, e.g., areas with underemployed Libertarian volunteers.</p>
<p>Putting a media office with publicist and front end secretary in DC has nothing to to with putting the back office operations in DC.</p>
<p>As to staff, for what we pay putting the office someplace where staff can afford to live might be an advantage as well as a disadvantage.</p>
<p>In my opinion, Uzbeckistan would not be so sensible a place for our party HQ, but one can find a list of other good choices fairly painlessly.  I&#8217;m not saying that moving is the right thing to do, but in considering it you would be better off having the alternatives a bit more clear in your thoughts.</p>
<p>Recall that this coming year that office will cost perhaps $140,000.</p>
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		<title>By: mscrib</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139188</link>
		<dc:creator>mscrib</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Dec 2009 00:51:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139188</guid>
		<description>@29

That cut office space costs, but try getting potential staff, media, think tankers, let alone interns to work/meet in a non-Arlington/MontCo &#039;burb or an economically-depressed, crime-ridden neighborhood in SE DC. If the LNC is dumb enough to move the national office out of NW DC to some PG County dump or somewhere in non-Metro-accessible NOVA, they might as well move the headquarters back to Texas (or North Dakota or Alaska or Uzbekistan, etc.) and SAVE EVEN MORE MONEY on office space.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@29</p>
<p>That cut office space costs, but try getting potential staff, media, think tankers, let alone interns to work/meet in a non-Arlington/MontCo &#8216;burb or an economically-depressed, crime-ridden neighborhood in SE DC. If the LNC is dumb enough to move the national office out of NW DC to some PG County dump or somewhere in non-Metro-accessible NOVA, they might as well move the headquarters back to Texas (or North Dakota or Alaska or Uzbekistan, etc.) and SAVE EVEN MORE MONEY on office space.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Capozzi</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139159</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Capozzi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 22:30:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139159</guid>
		<description>around 25, I&#039;ve not checked recently, but Manassas, Warrenton, Anacostia, or PG County probably all have lease rates half the Watergate&#039;s.  

How many years are left on the current lease?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>around 25, I&#8217;ve not checked recently, but Manassas, Warrenton, Anacostia, or PG County probably all have lease rates half the Watergate&#8217;s.  </p>
<p>How many years are left on the current lease?</p>
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		<title>By: George Phillies</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139152</link>
		<dc:creator>George Phillies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 21:58:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139152</guid>
		<description>@23  I can assure you that I did not choose the assumptions used in the LNC budget, the officers in some combination did.  The assumptions on membership were actually among the more optimistic of the outlined alternatives.  &#039;current lean times&#039; was not the general guiding principal.  You might find it more useful to read the document.

@25, @23  Either of the approaches you are considering would make more sense than what was proposed, though you could propose that the new income stream from Chair/ED fundraising counts as knocking on more doors.

@27 does someone have...?  Yes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@23  I can assure you that I did not choose the assumptions used in the LNC budget, the officers in some combination did.  The assumptions on membership were actually among the more optimistic of the outlined alternatives.  &#8216;current lean times&#8217; was not the general guiding principal.  You might find it more useful to read the document.</p>
<p>@25, @23  Either of the approaches you are considering would make more sense than what was proposed, though you could propose that the new income stream from Chair/ED fundraising counts as knocking on more doors.</p>
<p>@27 does someone have&#8230;?  Yes.</p>
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		<title>By: Aroundtheblockafewtimes</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139139</link>
		<dc:creator>Aroundtheblockafewtimes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 19:45:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139139</guid>
		<description>Does anyone have membership figures for, say, last twenty years and actual funds raised by National for those years?  It seems that the target for 2010 should be # members x average each member has given over that span of time.
Or what the average member gave in non-presidential years.  I have a gut feeling the targetted  revenue should be a lot higher in 2010, unless the average member has lost his or her zeal to donate to National.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does anyone have membership figures for, say, last twenty years and actual funds raised by National for those years?  It seems that the target for 2010 should be # members x average each member has given over that span of time.<br />
Or what the average member gave in non-presidential years.  I have a gut feeling the targetted  revenue should be a lot higher in 2010, unless the average member has lost his or her zeal to donate to National.</p>
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		<title>By: robert capozzi</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139108</link>
		<dc:creator>robert capozzi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 17:08:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139108</guid>
		<description>mhw, yes, also true.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mhw, yes, also true.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael H. Wilson</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139095</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael H. Wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 16:00:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139095</guid>
		<description>Robert where I&#039;m from when things get slow you get out, knock on more doors and get your product in front of more people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robert where I&#8217;m from when things get slow you get out, knock on more doors and get your product in front of more people.</p>
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		<title>By: Aroundtheblockafewtimes</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139094</link>
		<dc:creator>Aroundtheblockafewtimes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 15:57:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139094</guid>
		<description>What would similar office space lease for in Manassas or Warrenton, for example?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What would similar office space lease for in Manassas or Warrenton, for example?</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Capozzi</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139091</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Capozzi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 15:52:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139091</guid>
		<description>gp, I&#039;ve not reviewed the budget or your alternatives, but it sounds like you may be extrapolating based on current trends.  In my experience, businesses and organizations &quot;tap on their brakes,&quot; cut expenditures during lean times, with the idea that when conditions change, they can step back on the gas.  A &quot;slow death&quot; assumes conditions continue as they are, which is generally a poor assumption.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>gp, I&#8217;ve not reviewed the budget or your alternatives, but it sounds like you may be extrapolating based on current trends.  In my experience, businesses and organizations &#8220;tap on their brakes,&#8221; cut expenditures during lean times, with the idea that when conditions change, they can step back on the gas.  A &#8220;slow death&#8221; assumes conditions continue as they are, which is generally a poor assumption.</p>
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		<title>By: George Phillies</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-139087</link>
		<dc:creator>George Phillies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 15:30:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-139087</guid>
		<description>If you are steering the ship into the rocks, stopping the engines is a sensible first step.

&#039;suspend for cause&#039; is not punishment.  It is &#039;you are not doing the job&#039;.  That is a standard action of a board whose lead officers are not performing adequately.  In this case, the difficulty is that &#039;adequate&#039; -- do what we did last year -- involves a party that slowly dies, the newsletter coming out less and less often, etc., and there is no recognition that the proposal is a proposal for slow death.  Of course, you could ask &#039;how much money is spent on the things labelled &#039;none&#039; above&#039; and conclude that LNC Inc is already dead.

If the budget had said &#039;here is what we did last year, recycled, and there had been recognition that the outcome was unsatisfactory, you might have a case.

For alternative proposals, read Liberty for America magazine libertyforamerica.com, my 2000 book &#039;stand up for liberty!&#039;, and various articles here and at GoldAmericaGroup.com.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you are steering the ship into the rocks, stopping the engines is a sensible first step.</p>
<p>&#8216;suspend for cause&#8217; is not punishment.  It is &#8216;you are not doing the job&#8217;.  That is a standard action of a board whose lead officers are not performing adequately.  In this case, the difficulty is that &#8216;adequate&#8217; &#8212; do what we did last year &#8212; involves a party that slowly dies, the newsletter coming out less and less often, etc., and there is no recognition that the proposal is a proposal for slow death.  Of course, you could ask &#8216;how much money is spent on the things labelled &#8216;none&#8217; above&#8217; and conclude that LNC Inc is already dead.</p>
<p>If the budget had said &#8216;here is what we did last year, recycled, and there had been recognition that the outcome was unsatisfactory, you might have a case.</p>
<p>For alternative proposals, read Liberty for America magazine libertyforamerica.com, my 2000 book &#8216;stand up for liberty!&#8217;, and various articles here and at GoldAmericaGroup.com.</p>
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		<title>By: Danny S</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138850</link>
		<dc:creator>Danny S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 02:18:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138850</guid>
		<description>What is the alternative? The only alternative this article lines out is reject the budget and punish the perpetrators.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is the alternative? The only alternative this article lines out is reject the budget and punish the perpetrators.</p>
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		<title>By: Holden</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138841</link>
		<dc:creator>Holden</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 01:46:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138841</guid>
		<description>What has the LPMA done as a state affiliate? Is there anything that could be interpreted as a Phillies&#039; recipe for success that could be applied at the national level, or is Phillies just a disgruntled LP outcast who is bitter over his failure at being elected as the standard-bearer of the Party?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What has the LPMA done as a state affiliate? Is there anything that could be interpreted as a Phillies&#8217; recipe for success that could be applied at the national level, or is Phillies just a disgruntled LP outcast who is bitter over his failure at being elected as the standard-bearer of the Party?</p>
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		<title>By: paulie</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138662</link>
		<dc:creator>paulie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Dec 2009 15:17:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138662</guid>
		<description>17 is email address not URL. substitute @ for AT</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>17 is email address not URL. substitute @ for AT</p>
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		<title>By: George Phillies</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138659</link>
		<dc:creator>George Phillies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Dec 2009 15:13:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138659</guid>
		<description>@16

Actually, an alternative budget has already been proposed; this is the Massachusetts plan budget as covered in the October 2009 Liberty for America magazine, visible at LibertyForAmerica.com.  

@17
please check URL; it does not come up here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@16</p>
<p>Actually, an alternative budget has already been proposed; this is the Massachusetts plan budget as covered in the October 2009 Liberty for America magazine, visible at LibertyForAmerica.com.  </p>
<p>@17<br />
please check URL; it does not come up here.</p>
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		<title>By: Ralph Swanson</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138597</link>
		<dc:creator>Ralph Swanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Dec 2009 10:31:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138597</guid>
		<description>@6 Dr. Phillies,

LibIntOrgATMsn.com

Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@6 Dr. Phillies,</p>
<p>LibIntOrgATMsn.com</p>
<p>Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: Rorschach</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138554</link>
		<dc:creator>Rorschach</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Dec 2009 06:17:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138554</guid>
		<description>Mr. Phillies has proposed a course of action that is undeniably impractical. There have been numerous majority votes on this board over the years that set the Party on this course. To censure only two of the current officers is simultaneously excessive and ineffectual. The complaints he raises, however, have undeniable merit.

The Libertarian Party suffers intractable delusions of grandeur at all levels. It attempts to simulate success by taking a course of action befitting a much larger, more successful organization when it would behoove them to know their station.

New computers and phones? An office suite in the District of Columbia? The Libertarians are not the Republicans. Financially, they are not even the Greens.

This Barry Lyndon approach to success will cost their Party at least a leg, if not an arm as well, and doom it to an obscure death and forgotten existence in America.

It is the responsibility of the board to be honest enough with the nature of the organization for which it is responsible to acknowledge these facts. Without acknowledgment of the problems there will never be solutions. To that end, the only action item in this article with which it is remotely appropriate to agree is to reject this budget. However, I strongly suggest that an alternative be created before the committee calls the vote, lest precious time be wasted.

As an apt aside, it seems that the character of these difficulties is not isolated to the upper echelons of the Party, as indicated by the misuse of the &quot;Stone Soup&quot; analogy. As I recall, the moral of the story is that if you are willing to lie to people more useful than yourself, you can get them to feed you for nothing.

?R</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Phillies has proposed a course of action that is undeniably impractical. There have been numerous majority votes on this board over the years that set the Party on this course. To censure only two of the current officers is simultaneously excessive and ineffectual. The complaints he raises, however, have undeniable merit.</p>
<p>The Libertarian Party suffers intractable delusions of grandeur at all levels. It attempts to simulate success by taking a course of action befitting a much larger, more successful organization when it would behoove them to know their station.</p>
<p>New computers and phones? An office suite in the District of Columbia? The Libertarians are not the Republicans. Financially, they are not even the Greens.</p>
<p>This Barry Lyndon approach to success will cost their Party at least a leg, if not an arm as well, and doom it to an obscure death and forgotten existence in America.</p>
<p>It is the responsibility of the board to be honest enough with the nature of the organization for which it is responsible to acknowledge these facts. Without acknowledgment of the problems there will never be solutions. To that end, the only action item in this article with which it is remotely appropriate to agree is to reject this budget. However, I strongly suggest that an alternative be created before the committee calls the vote, lest precious time be wasted.</p>
<p>As an apt aside, it seems that the character of these difficulties is not isolated to the upper echelons of the Party, as indicated by the misuse of the &#8220;Stone Soup&#8221; analogy. As I recall, the moral of the story is that if you are willing to lie to people more useful than yourself, you can get them to feed you for nothing.</p>
<p>?R</p>
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		<title>By: Don Lake .......... John Anderson volunteer 1980</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138507</link>
		<dc:creator>Don Lake .......... John Anderson volunteer 1980</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Dec 2009 03:28:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138507</guid>
		<description>All your stone soup are belong to us  // Dec 5, 2009 at 2:09 pm:

When it comes to competition there are two basic tacks:

1. Build up that which you like.

2. Tear down that which you dislike.

........... taking cues from the deform /reform movement are we ???????????</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All your stone soup are belong to us  // Dec 5, 2009 at 2:09 pm:</p>
<p>When it comes to competition there are two basic tacks:</p>
<p>1. Build up that which you like.</p>
<p>2. Tear down that which you dislike.</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.. taking cues from the deform /reform movement are we ???????????</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Capozzi</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138483</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Capozzi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Dec 2009 23:58:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=11046#comment-138483</guid>
		<description>stone soup:  Isn’t that [(tearing) down that which you dislike] part of politics though?

me:  It&#039;d be foolish to say No.  OTOH, participating in character assassination is like throwing a bad-karma boomerang.  It comes back and hits ya upside the head.  I&#039;d hope Ls shun such dysfunctional behavior...our task is big enough as it is!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>stone soup:  Isn’t that [(tearing) down that which you dislike] part of politics though?</p>
<p>me:  It&#8217;d be foolish to say No.  OTOH, participating in character assassination is like throwing a bad-karma boomerang.  It comes back and hits ya upside the head.  I&#8217;d hope Ls shun such dysfunctional behavior&#8230;our task is big enough as it is!</p>
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		<title>By: paulie</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/george-phillies-new-lnc-budget-is-slow-death-for-our-party/comment-page-1/#comment-138472</link>
		<dc:creator>paulie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Dec 2009 23:37:51 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/12/lnc-meeting-thread/</description>
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