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	<title>Comments on: Constitution Party to Barack Obama: Got Birth Certificate?</title>
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	<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/12/constitution-party-to-barack-obama-got-birth-certificate/</link>
	<description>Covering America's third parties and independent candidates since May 2008</description>
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		<title>By: Von Baren</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/12/constitution-party-to-barack-obama-got-birth-certificate/comment-page-1/#comment-30480</link>
		<dc:creator>Von Baren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 06:39:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=5374#comment-30480</guid>
		<description>scooterbird,
Your one point on the birth annoucement address on August 13, 1962 doesn&#039;t confirm anything.   If  parents were British subjects or illegal aliens working in Hawaii, with an obviously an Hawaii address the citzenship question is still open.
As far as the State officials, come on, get real, politics is politic whether in Illinois or Hawaii tit is the same.   The State Official just needed to produce the long form and it would be settled.
The question that is not confirmed to the Public&#039;s satifaction is simple.  Natural-born or Naturalized?  If we used newspapers to confirm citzenship ... there would be no need for immigration Reform ... right?

Just an opinion :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>scooterbird,<br />
Your one point on the birth annoucement address on August 13, 1962 doesn&#8217;t confirm anything.   If  parents were British subjects or illegal aliens working in Hawaii, with an obviously an Hawaii address the citzenship question is still open.<br />
As far as the State officials, come on, get real, politics is politic whether in Illinois or Hawaii tit is the same.   The State Official just needed to produce the long form and it would be settled.<br />
The question that is not confirmed to the Public&#8217;s satifaction is simple.  Natural-born or Naturalized?  If we used newspapers to confirm citzenship &#8230; there would be no need for immigration Reform &#8230; right?</p>
<p>Just an opinion <img src='http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: scooterbird</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/12/constitution-party-to-barack-obama-got-birth-certificate/comment-page-1/#comment-30138</link>
		<dc:creator>scooterbird</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Dec 2008 14:47:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=5374#comment-30138</guid>
		<description>Correct.  Appearance on a state ballot is no proof of citizenship, or qualification for office.  Roger Calero has never stated that he is a citizen, or that he is Constitutionally eligible for the office of President.

Barack Obama has done both of these things, and has in fact proven them beyond any reasonable doubt.  The COLB would list a foreign birthplace if the supposed &quot;Kenyan birth certificate&quot; (which has never been produced by anyone at any time) was accepted in Hawai&#039;i.  Instead, the place of birth is clearly given as Honolulu, Honolulu County, Hawai&#039;i.

Hawai&#039;ian health department officials have produced the short form.  It is certified by the state registrar and the director of the Hawai&#039;i Department of Health has given a press statement verifying that the long form exists and has been personally physically verified.  The former is all the proof that is needed in a court of law.  The latter would tend to support the former assuming that the case goes forward - which is extremely unlikely, as there is no evidence at all to the contrary.

Although it is not legally binding, your facts to the contrary might also strive to take into account the birth announcement in the Honolulu Advertiser of August 13, 1961, which lists the address in Hawai&#039;i (not Kenya, not Indonesia, not Mars) of President-Elect Obama&#039;s parents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correct.  Appearance on a state ballot is no proof of citizenship, or qualification for office.  Roger Calero has never stated that he is a citizen, or that he is Constitutionally eligible for the office of President.</p>
<p>Barack Obama has done both of these things, and has in fact proven them beyond any reasonable doubt.  The COLB would list a foreign birthplace if the supposed &#8220;Kenyan birth certificate&#8221; (which has never been produced by anyone at any time) was accepted in Hawai&#8217;i.  Instead, the place of birth is clearly given as Honolulu, Honolulu County, Hawai&#8217;i.</p>
<p>Hawai&#8217;ian health department officials have produced the short form.  It is certified by the state registrar and the director of the Hawai&#8217;i Department of Health has given a press statement verifying that the long form exists and has been personally physically verified.  The former is all the proof that is needed in a court of law.  The latter would tend to support the former assuming that the case goes forward &#8211; which is extremely unlikely, as there is no evidence at all to the contrary.</p>
<p>Although it is not legally binding, your facts to the contrary might also strive to take into account the birth announcement in the Honolulu Advertiser of August 13, 1961, which lists the address in Hawai&#8217;i (not Kenya, not Indonesia, not Mars) of President-Elect Obama&#8217;s parents.</p>
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		<title>By: rxsid</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/12/constitution-party-to-barack-obama-got-birth-certificate/comment-page-1/#comment-30053</link>
		<dc:creator>rxsid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Dec 2008 02:31:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=5374#comment-30053</guid>
		<description>Incorrect Micaheal.  They released a short form colb.  Hardly proof of his place of birth.

Some facts:

A)  Hawaiian law, at the time of Obama&#039;s birth, allowed for FOREIGN born baby&#039;s to be registered in Hawaii via a &#039;Certificate of Live Birth&#039;:  
&quot;[Â§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State...&quot;

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol06_Ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.htm

B)  The Hawaiian govt&#039; officials NEVER stated that Obama was born in Hawaii.  They only stated that they have seen his birth certificate on file.  But a B.C. from where?? (see #1 above).

On October 31, 2008, Dr Chiyome Fukino, Department of Health:
&quot;Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaiâ€˜i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaiâ€˜i State Department of Health has Sen. Obamaâ€™s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.&quot;
http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf

For the Hawaiian &#039;Policies and Procedures&#039; she refereed to...see item #1 above which, again, affords foreign born babies to obtain a Hawaiian COLB.  
Legally, the Hawaiian Governor &amp; the Dpt of Health official merely stated fact based on their own laws.  One can obviously see that a Kenyan B.C. from 1961 would be legal and valid per Hawaiian law.  This would also allow Obama to obtain a U.S. Passport.

C) Examples of Hawaiian Long Form COLB&#039;s:  
1963 Hawaiian Long Form COLB:
http://a5.vox.com/6a00c2252293c4604a0100a80270e5000e-pi
1962 Hawaiian Long Form COLB:
http://passportsusa.com/wp-content/gallery/passportusa/edith_front.jpg

Obviously, what the Obama camp has released looks nothing like those two Hawaiian COLB&#039;s from that time.  Where&#039;s his?

D) If it&#039;s proven Obama was indeed foreign born (Kenya), He would NOT have received U.S. citizenship based, only, on his mother&#039;s citizenship status. Per U.S. law at the time of his birth (December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986).  
Birth Abroad to One Citizen and One Alien Parent in Wedlock:
&quot;For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986, a period of ten years, five after the age of fourteen are required for physical presence in the U.S. to transmit U.S. citizenship to the child.&quot;

http://travel.state.gov/law/info/info_609.html

Note that the law only pertains to &#039;Citizenship&#039;, and not &#039;Natural Born&#039; Citizen.  There is a difference.  Governor Schwarzenegger from Ca. is a citizen, yet he could not be POTUS because he isn&#039;t a Natural Born citizen.  He&#039;s a Naturalized citizen.

Obama&#039;s mother didn&#039;t give birth to him at 19 (14 + 5).  Therefore, Obama could not obtain U.S. citizenship based only by virtue his mother&#039;s citizenship.

E) And then there is the dual citizenship issue (which could make the above totally irrelevant).  Factcheck themselves state that Obama was indeed a British subject and did in fact hold dual citizenship AT Birth.

http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/does_barack_obama_have_kenyan_citizenship.html
&quot;In other words, at the time of his birth, Barack Obama Jr. was both a U.S. citizen ... and a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies (or the UKC)&quot;

So even IF he was indeed born in Hawaii (would be easy for him to prove but hasn&#039;t so far), Obama could therefore not be a Natural Born citizen because Natural Born citizens can not hold dual citizenship at birth.  It has to do with the potential for divided loyalties and the very reason the
writers of the Constitution themselves allowed for their exception (grandfathered in) because all of them were British Subjects at birth.

He might be a &quot;Naturalized&quot; Citizen, but there is nothing (to date) in the public sector to suggest he is a &#039;Natural Born&quot; Citizen, the Constitution clearly requires for one to become POTUS.

F) Without question, the Secretary of State of New Jersey (&amp; possibly other SoS&#039;s) did NOT do their job in making sure the presidential candidates (including Obama) were qualified and eligible to be on their states&#039; ballot.

Why?

How would the SoS from NJ explain that Roger Calero was on their ballet as a candidate?

Socialist Workers Party candidate Roger Calero isn&#039;t even a U.S. citizen (Naturalized OR Natural Born), yet appeared on NJâ€™s presidential ballot.

Calero was also allowed on the state ballot in: Delaware, Minnesota, New York and Vermont.

Calero is a permanent resident alien (holding a green card).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%B3ger_Calero

Note:  Not in any particular order.  Simply, points of fact and information.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incorrect Micaheal.  They released a short form colb.  Hardly proof of his place of birth.</p>
<p>Some facts:</p>
<p>A)  Hawaiian law, at the time of Obama&#8217;s birth, allowed for FOREIGN born baby&#8217;s to be registered in Hawaii via a &#8216;Certificate of Live Birth&#8217;:<br />
&#8220;[Â§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol06_Ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol06_Ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.htm</a></p>
<p>B)  The Hawaiian govt&#8217; officials NEVER stated that Obama was born in Hawaii.  They only stated that they have seen his birth certificate on file.  But a B.C. from where?? (see #1 above).</p>
<p>On October 31, 2008, Dr Chiyome Fukino, Department of Health:<br />
&#8220;Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaiâ€˜i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaiâ€˜i State Department of Health has Sen. Obamaâ€™s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf</a></p>
<p>For the Hawaiian &#8216;Policies and Procedures&#8217; she refereed to&#8230;see item #1 above which, again, affords foreign born babies to obtain a Hawaiian COLB.<br />
Legally, the Hawaiian Governor &amp; the Dpt of Health official merely stated fact based on their own laws.  One can obviously see that a Kenyan B.C. from 1961 would be legal and valid per Hawaiian law.  This would also allow Obama to obtain a U.S. Passport.</p>
<p>C) Examples of Hawaiian Long Form COLB&#8217;s:<br />
1963 Hawaiian Long Form COLB:<br />
<a href="http://a5.vox.com/6a00c2252293c4604a0100a80270e5000e-pi" rel="nofollow">http://a5.vox.com/6a00c2252293c4604a0100a80270e5000e-pi</a><br />
1962 Hawaiian Long Form COLB:<br />
<a href="http://passportsusa.com/wp-content/gallery/passportusa/edith_front.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://passportsusa.com/wp-content/gallery/passportusa/edith_front.jpg</a></p>
<p>Obviously, what the Obama camp has released looks nothing like those two Hawaiian COLB&#8217;s from that time.  Where&#8217;s his?</p>
<p>D) If it&#8217;s proven Obama was indeed foreign born (Kenya), He would NOT have received U.S. citizenship based, only, on his mother&#8217;s citizenship status. Per U.S. law at the time of his birth (December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986).<br />
Birth Abroad to One Citizen and One Alien Parent in Wedlock:<br />
&#8220;For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986, a period of ten years, five after the age of fourteen are required for physical presence in the U.S. to transmit U.S. citizenship to the child.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://travel.state.gov/law/info/info_609.html" rel="nofollow">http://travel.state.gov/law/info/info_609.html</a></p>
<p>Note that the law only pertains to &#8216;Citizenship&#8217;, and not &#8216;Natural Born&#8217; Citizen.  There is a difference.  Governor Schwarzenegger from Ca. is a citizen, yet he could not be POTUS because he isn&#8217;t a Natural Born citizen.  He&#8217;s a Naturalized citizen.</p>
<p>Obama&#8217;s mother didn&#8217;t give birth to him at 19 (14 + 5).  Therefore, Obama could not obtain U.S. citizenship based only by virtue his mother&#8217;s citizenship.</p>
<p>E) And then there is the dual citizenship issue (which could make the above totally irrelevant).  Factcheck themselves state that Obama was indeed a British subject and did in fact hold dual citizenship AT Birth.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/does_barack_obama_have_kenyan_citizenship.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/does_barack_obama_have_kenyan_citizenship.html</a><br />
&#8220;In other words, at the time of his birth, Barack Obama Jr. was both a U.S. citizen &#8230; and a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies (or the UKC)&#8221;</p>
<p>So even IF he was indeed born in Hawaii (would be easy for him to prove but hasn&#8217;t so far), Obama could therefore not be a Natural Born citizen because Natural Born citizens can not hold dual citizenship at birth.  It has to do with the potential for divided loyalties and the very reason the<br />
writers of the Constitution themselves allowed for their exception (grandfathered in) because all of them were British Subjects at birth.</p>
<p>He might be a &#8220;Naturalized&#8221; Citizen, but there is nothing (to date) in the public sector to suggest he is a &#8216;Natural Born&#8221; Citizen, the Constitution clearly requires for one to become POTUS.</p>
<p>F) Without question, the Secretary of State of New Jersey (&amp; possibly other SoS&#8217;s) did NOT do their job in making sure the presidential candidates (including Obama) were qualified and eligible to be on their states&#8217; ballot.</p>
<p>Why?</p>
<p>How would the SoS from NJ explain that Roger Calero was on their ballet as a candidate?</p>
<p>Socialist Workers Party candidate Roger Calero isn&#8217;t even a U.S. citizen (Naturalized OR Natural Born), yet appeared on NJâ€™s presidential ballot.</p>
<p>Calero was also allowed on the state ballot in: Delaware, Minnesota, New York and Vermont.</p>
<p>Calero is a permanent resident alien (holding a green card).<br />
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%B3ger_Calero" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%B3ger_Calero</a></p>
<p>Note:  Not in any particular order.  Simply, points of fact and information.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael H. Wilson</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/12/constitution-party-to-barack-obama-got-birth-certificate/comment-page-1/#comment-30050</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael H. Wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Dec 2008 02:09:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=5374#comment-30050</guid>
		<description>As I recall the campaign had already released his birth certificate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I recall the campaign had already released his birth certificate.</p>
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		<title>By: paulie cannoli</title>
		<link>http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/12/constitution-party-to-barack-obama-got-birth-certificate/comment-page-1/#comment-30003</link>
		<dc:creator>paulie cannoli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Dec 2008 20:28:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/?p=5374#comment-30003</guid>
		<description>@ BAN

&lt;i&gt;
The U.S. Supreme Court held a conference on the morning of December 12, and in the afternoon announced it had accepted two new cases. Both of them are disputes about commercial matters. The Court said nothing about any further pending cases concerning Barack Obamaâ€™s eligibility, but on Monday when the â€œrefusedâ€ list is released to the public, any such cases will probably be on the list.&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ BAN</p>
<p><i><br />
The U.S. Supreme Court held a conference on the morning of December 12, and in the afternoon announced it had accepted two new cases. Both of them are disputes about commercial matters. The Court said nothing about any further pending cases concerning Barack Obamaâ€™s eligibility, but on Monday when the â€œrefusedâ€ list is released to the public, any such cases will probably be on the list.</i></p>
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