Tune in at 9 PM Eastern time (8 PM Central, 7 PM Mountain, 6 PM Pacific, 5 PM Alaska, 4 PM Hawai’i) in the comments on this post, and add your own.
IPR has previously covered the debate:
Internet Pettition to demand Bob Barr’s participation in debate is being circulated
Free and Equal debate picked up on C-SPAN for Live coverage
Updates on the Free and Equal debate
Freeandequal.org debate is on; Ralph Nader and Chuck Baldwin confirmed
Two Presidential candidates confirmed for debate in DC on Thursday, October 23
The moderator will be Chris Hedges from the Nation Institute. In addition to CSPAN, it will also be carried live on Restore the Republic Radio.
226 responses so far ↓
1 Hugh Jass // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:36 pm
Nobody posted about Ron Paul now being an official write-in candidate in the most populous state in the Union?
2 Trent Hill // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:40 pm
Im getting to it.
3 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:42 pm
Do you have confirmation on that?
4 Hugh Jass // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:42 pm
It was on DailyPaul and LRC.
5 Mike Gillis // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:43 pm
Are we talking about California?
6 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:45 pm
@ TPW
# Bill Lussenheide Says:
October 22nd, 2008 at 11:44 pm
I can assure you that Ron Paul IS NOT a write in candidate in California.
I was involved in the process of getting Chuck Baldwin on the California certified write in list. The Secretary of State requires a declaration of candidacy SIGNED by the candidate, in addition to 55 notarized and jurated electoral college nominees. So unless Ron Paul signed a declaration, then he is not a write in candidate.
The deadline for paperwork was October 21st.
7 gls // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:52 pm
I’m skeptical of the CA write-in story. Paul would’ve had to fill out and sign this form: http://www.frankmooreforpresident08.com/forms/california_statement_write-in_2008.pdf
8 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:52 pm
Video of debate will be at theywillbeheard.com
9 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 7:53 pm
RTR Radio will have Baldwin and hopefully Nader for post-debate interviews
10 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:19 pm
Anyone else planning to liveblog besides me?
11 Gregg Jocoy // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:36 pm
Cynthia McKinney addressed her decision to not participate in this debate, and Ron Hardy wrote it up at Green Party Watch.
12 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:37 pm
I copied that in two of the posts linked in here
http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/10/cynthia-mckinney-and-bob-barr-react-to-tonights-free-and-equal-debate-between-ralph-nader-and-chuck-baldwin/
and
http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2008/10/green-party-presidential-candidate-cynthia-mckinney-on-npr-break-the-matrix-democracy-now-opednews-youtube/
13 Trent Hill // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:39 pm
Seems dumb. McKinney is completely opposed to participating in media…
14 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:40 pm
Not completely. See the second link in my last comment.
15 svf // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:45 pm
Anyone else planning to liveblog besides me?
Grey’s Anatomy > Nader + Baldwin
Sorry guys… maybe next time…
16 Trent Hill // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:49 pm
Um no. Grey’s Anatony
But, The Office>Either Grey’s Anatomy or Nader+Baldwin.
17 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:52 pm
To each their own. TV ain’t shit to me.
On the rare occasion I am not either on the computer or outdoors, if I don’t need to use the bathroom or kitchen or bed, I flip through the video/music channels for a few minutes.
Otherwise, fuggedaboutit.
18 Trent Hill // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:55 pm
I watch basically one show per night.
19 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:57 pm
live chat
http://www.rtrradio.com/chat.aspx
20 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:57 pm
About 80 people in audience
21 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 8:59 pm
http://theywillbeheard.com/
22 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:00 pm
Debate rules being explained
23 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:01 pm
Chuck Baldwin intro
24 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:02 pm
Mentions that the CP is 3rd in registrations, believes in the Constitution, and most of the country’s problems are because of the major parties ignoring the Constitution, the Bible, and their oath of office.
25 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:05 pm
CB: 100% pro-life, anti gay marriage, pro 2nd Amendment, anti immigration, declared wars only, state sovereignty
26 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:05 pm
Let’s start a post that we continually update instead of doing it in the comments.
27 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:05 pm
Tried that before at LFV, did not work as well.
28 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:06 pm
Nader: rule by the people not the corporations, living wage, national health care
29 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:08 pm
First question: Zinn and Chomsky will vote for Obama, even though they have been very critical of major parties. Discuss.
30 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:09 pm
Nader: that allows the least worst to ignore them and compromise with the worst instead.
31 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:10 pm
Nader: Especially easy to vote for him in non-swing states.
32 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:10 pm
Baldwin: Don’t waste your vote, don’t vote McCain. McCain can’t win, don’t compromise your principles.
33 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:11 pm
Baldwin: A wasted vote is one for someone who does not have the same values you do.
34 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:11 pm
Should I start a new post?
35 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:11 pm
No, here is good./
36 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:11 pm
Baldwin:
McCain 2008=Bob Dole 1996
37 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:12 pm
I’m watching the debate with Nader people. Good times.
38 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:13 pm
Nader: Third parties put issues on the table first.
39 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:14 pm
Tell us what they say, Jeremy!
40 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:14 pm
Hedges: What about pragmatism?
41 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:14 pm
Nader: Debate commission is a private company. Alternative candidates excluded from polls.
42 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:15 pm
Baldwin: Republicans were a minor party in 1860.
43 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:15 pm
Excellent point by Baldwin about the multi-party system in Iraq. If it’s good enough for them, why isn’t it good enough for us?
44 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:15 pm
That’s not entirely fair about Obama’s donations, Nader, because he’s raised so much money in general that that is unavoidable. And Nader, does that mean money from the companies themselves or money from their employees?
45 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:16 pm
Baldwin: 80% of Michigan voters willing to consider a third party
46 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:16 pm
They’re Arabs. According to McCain that makes them bad people.
47 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:17 pm
Hedges: What about the bailout?
48 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:17 pm
Nader: Democratic party ignores its base constituencies - both parties are getting worse every time, more controlled by corporations.
49 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:17 pm
In case you don’t know, this is live on CSpan 2 right now.
50 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:18 pm
Baldwin: it’s like a choice between Nero and Caligula
51 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:18 pm
Hedges shouldn’t talk more than the candidates do. The Nader people here agree with me.
52 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:19 pm
Nader: Corporations are giving more money to Obama than McCain.
Baldwin: Doesn’t matter which duopoly wing administers the same iniquities.
53 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:20 pm
I wish they would’ve given the candidates more time to question each other. There’s no reason to have the same format as the corporate debates.
54 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:21 pm
Baldwin: Toss out congressmen who voted for the bailout, and the federal reserve while we’re at it.
55 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:21 pm
Baldwin: Ron Paul endorsed me.
56 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:22 pm
Stop leading them on, Hedges.
57 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:22 pm
Nader: bailout is the collapse of corporate capitalist ideology.
58 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:22 pm
Baldwin is an excellent debater.
59 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:23 pm
Nader: corporations are shipping our jobs to fascist dictatorships, bailout is removing market discipline from big businesses but not small business. Put in a transaction tax on stock trades.
60 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:24 pm
Baldwin: fiat money is fraudulent. We are the greatest debtor nation in the history of the world, debt growing with no end in sight.
61 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:25 pm
Baldwin: “The free market always works, it always has and it always will” — yeah, right. Even in Roman days there was a free market. And the emperor was just sort of a…senior stockbroker.
62 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:25 pm
Baldwin: Appoint Ron Paul or someone like him Secretary of the Treasury, bring back sound money, repeal Fed, IRS and income tax.
63 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:26 pm
Nader supporter next to me: “I don’t think there’s ever been a free market.”
64 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:26 pm
Nader: Re-regulation
65 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:26 pm
Jeremy Young #63: Precisely the problem
66 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:27 pm
Nader: criminal prosecutions of Wall Street crooks.
67 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:28 pm
Q: War on Terror
68 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:28 pm
Hedges: reading a term paper about American foreign policy.
69 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:28 pm
Damn these questions are long
70 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:29 pm
Is Hedges running for President?
71 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:29 pm
I didn’t realize Hedges was a candidate.
72 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:30 pm
Nader: Obama will be like another Bush term, no different from McCain and Bush on middle east issues.
73 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:30 pm
Haha, I didn’t see 70.
Nader: Little difference between major candidates on Iraq, they’ll keep at least some bases there. 400 Arabs dead to one Israeli dead would be called anti-Semitism the other way around.
74 Catholic Trotskyist // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:31 pm
For some eason, CSpan2 in my area is not covering it. Still, I am confident that with God’s help and blessing, Christian Revolutionary Colonel Chuck Baldwin is tuterly defeating and humiliating fascist/stalinist criminal Ralph Nader. I have also heard from inside sources at the Vatican that the pope is about to excommunicate Ralph Nader.
75 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:31 pm
Haha, I didn’t see 70.
We’ll have duplication aplenty. All good.
76 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:31 pm
Baldwin: No foreign aid.
To absolutely cut it off would be a scary thing.
77 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:32 pm
Nader: AIPAC has too much influence. He supports two state solution for Israel-Palestine.
78 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:32 pm
Baldwin: We are globalising too much. We follow the UN too much.
That’s not true. We break international treaties all the time, and it’s a big treaty. That is, the problem of the idea of “American exceptionalism.”
79 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:32 pm
#77 - So do Obama and McCain and Bush. Ah!
80 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:33 pm
Baldwin: The real battle is between new world order globalists and constitutionalists; mentions immigration, foreign aid.
81 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:33 pm
Catholic Trotskyist, can’t you watch it on c-span.org?
82 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:34 pm
Pre-emptive war
83 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:34 pm
Nader: It violates international treaties and the Constitution. Congress is abrogating its responsibility.
84 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:35 pm
Nader: Surge in Afghanistan would be like “fire on gasoline,” could destabilize Pakistan.
85 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:35 pm
Baldwin: Only Congress can declare war. We must follow Constitution. I like Ron Paul.
86 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:36 pm
Nader: Congress and judiciary are giving way to imperial presidency; international law is being ignored and violated. Obama is beligerent like McCain. US foreign policy is leading to blowback and terrorism; Iran war looming.
87 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:36 pm
Nader: “I’m Eugene Debs!”
Baldwin: “I’m Ron Paul!”
88 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:37 pm
Nader: remove military contractors.
89 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:37 pm
Here’s what I think will be one of the true tests of Obama’s presidency: will be reduce the power of the presidency?
If he gets rid of most/all of Bush’s advancement of presidential power, he will be a great man.
90 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:38 pm
Baldwin: Marquee and reprisal, Ron Paul, Thomas Jefferson…
91 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:38 pm
Baldwin: we need more ships in our navy so we can keep China out of the Panama Canal.
WHAT???
92 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:40 pm
Baldwin: Russia and China are threats; we should not be reducing the size of the military or getting bogged down in the mideast. A little Reagan worship thrown in. Opposes “Patriot Act” though.
93 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:40 pm
Hedges mentions police horse trampling Iraq vet against war, asks about signing statements, habeas corpus suspension
94 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:41 pm
Baldwin: I’m a REAL conservative.
95 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:41 pm
….Democrats in Congress went along….
96 Catholic Trotskyist // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:42 pm
Christian Revolutionary Colonel Baldwin continues to make fantastic and earth-shattering points about such things as the wars, the Patriot Act, abortion, gay marriage and trade. While appealing to conservatives with his Christian governmentcontrol and anti-immigrant stance. Meanwhile, Nader is being utterly humiliated. Baldwin, Keep on stealing those Republican votes, sir. Victory for Obama, 12 days away! Amen.
97 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:42 pm
Score one for Baldwin on “conservatives shouldn’t support the Patriot Act”. Almost makes up for his crazy conspiracy things about the Chinese navy in Panama. Not quite, though.
98 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:43 pm
(Feed cut out, missed Baldwin’s answer)
99 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:43 pm
Nader: We need national referenda!
Glad he said it, even if he barely mentioned it. I’m so happy he endorsed the Ni4D and lists it on his website, but he doesn’t give it too much attention.
100 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:43 pm
Nader: put impeachment back on the table; allow citizens to sue politicians and bureaucrats. Endorses National Initiative.
101 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:44 pm
I’m watching it on a TV so big Chris Hedges’ forehead is at least 18 square feet.
102 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:44 pm
Nader: draft children of Congressmen.
103 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:44 pm
Note to Nader: when Chuck Baldwin laughs at you, something’s wrong. Because Chuck Baldwin’s crazy.
104 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:45 pm
Plus, it’s too bad only .001% of the people watching will realize what Nader said about national referenda. If you don’t stress that point, people don’t connect to it. I saw it with Gravel in the Dem debates.
105 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:45 pm
103 - maybe that actually means Nader’s the sane one.
106 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:45 pm
Baldwin: we are edging closer to a police state, and does not believe it is accidental.
107 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:45 pm
Ross, Hedges’ head really IS that big.
Okay, what’s the craziest answer of the night? Nader wanting to draft the President, or Baldwin wanting to defend Panama from the Chinese navy?
Too bad we don’t have McKinney there, then we’d have some real crazies.
108 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:46 pm
Baldwin - provisions of post 9/11 legislation were proposed a decade earlier.
109 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:46 pm
Yeah, good on Nader for talking about binding national referenda. (Even though I don’t support the NI4D.)
110 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:46 pm
Draft the president? I must not have been paying attention at that part. What did he say?
111 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:47 pm
Halliburton’s stock has more than doubled since the start of the Iraq war.
It’s sick.
112 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:47 pm
I’d say I support direct democracy in general more than I just support the Ni4D.
113 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:48 pm
Nader: Force fields? Whaa?
114 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:49 pm
Great question, Hedges. I’m glad you asked it.
He asked about whether local third party politics is more effective.
My answer to it would be that you need a combo of national and local, because national brings a lot more attention to it, but local gets more people elected. (I think local politics should be more important, though)
115 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:49 pm
#112 — with you on that one.
#110 — wasn’t that what he said? Draft the President and Congress every time you go to war?
116 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:49 pm
Q: Progressive Party of Vermont
117 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:50 pm
Q. Aren’t you guys stupid?
118 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:50 pm
Nader: Possible to knock on all the doors in Vermont, not NYC or nationwide.
119 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:51 pm
115 - I trust you. I’ve only been paying half attention.
120 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:52 pm
Baldwin: We don’t get enough credit.
121 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:52 pm
aka “Gimme a friggin break”
122 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:54 pm
Nader: Obama raises more money every day than we do for the whole campaign, so send me money.
123 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:54 pm
Baldwin: we need a 6-candidate debate.
124 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:57 pm
Nader: Majority of voters want us in the debates with Republicans and Democrats. Mentions signature gathering and ballot access lawsuits. No Western country obstructs participation in elections this way; calls it Jim Crow discrimination.
125 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:57 pm
Nader: Only one candidate in many districts.
126 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:58 pm
Baldwin: major media have become lapdogs of the major parties.
127 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:59 pm
Baldwin: Candidates like Ron Paul and Kucinich ignored and mistreated by their parties and the media.
128 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:59 pm
Nader: Jim Crow for candidates = Jim Crow for voters (no offense Cynthia).
129 sunshinebatman // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:59 pm
And if Barr were there, he could have pointed out he was the guy who defeated them.
Maybe next time.
paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 9:46 pm
Baldwin - provisions of post 9/11 legislation were proposed a decade earlier.
130 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:00 pm
$708,000 is chump change for Obama.
131 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:01 pm
Last question, health care
132 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:01 pm
Last question, have you fallen asleep during this question?
133 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:01 pm
Hedges: Maybe I’ll leave you guys a few seconds to answer me.
134 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:01 pm
CSpan is saying you can call in. I’m calling in and asking about the Ni4D.
135 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:02 pm
What’s the phone number?
136 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:02 pm
Hedges: Maybe I’ll leave you guys a few seconds to answer me.
…I said maybe!@
137 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:03 pm
Maybe, maybe not….
138 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:03 pm
Hedges is going for a new Guinness record with this “question”
139 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:04 pm
Baldwin: No more socialism in health care. Government just makes bad problems worse.
140 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:05 pm
Baldwin: If you believe in Jesus, your problems will go away.
141 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:05 pm
(He didn’t really say that)
142 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:05 pm
Draws parallel between socializing market risk with the Wall Street bailout with socializing personal risk with national health care; recalls affordable fee for service health care.
143 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:06 pm
Does anyone see a phone number to call?
144 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:06 pm
Baldwin: It’s not moral to cut welfare programs right away.
Good for him. I’ve been waiting to hear that.
145 paulie cannoli // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:06 pm
Nader: health care should be like police protection and fire protection because people die. Supports single payer, denies that it is socialized medicine.
146 Jeremy Young // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:07 pm
Nader rocks on single payer.
147 Morgan Wick // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:08 pm
“Does anyone see a phone number to call?”
They generally don’t show the phone numbers until it’s actually time to call.
148 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:09 pm
Thanks.
Baldwin: Let’s prosecute Wall Street fat cats, not give them money, and agree that some regulation is reasonable in many areas. We need accountability.
149 Ross Levin // Oct 23, 2008 at 10:09 pm